It's impossible to keep up with all the bad press the RCMP is getting. Evey day a new horror story. Police brutality, sexual harassment, sexual assault, impaired driving, hit and run, the list goes on and on and on. We've gone from accusations of the police blackmailing prostitutes to having sex with them and trying to smuggle a prostitute onto a police cruse ship doing security for the Olympics to numerous allegations of sexual harassment at the workplace and even several allegations of police officers raping fellow police officers. The number of cases is absurd. It forces the average civilian to ask what the hell is going on there? The professional image isn't just tarnished, it looks more like a circus of unprofessionalism.
Making a politically incorrect statement is one thing but raping a fellow officer is another. During the Olympics a police officer was accused of raping a fellow officer. We are told alcohol played a factor. Yet back in 2003, Four female RCMP officers alleged they were sexually assaulted by one of their superiors.
We are well aware of the disastrous affair with a witness in the Surrey Six Murder trial. The front page of Friday's Vancouver Province contained yet another accusation from another witness at the current sexual harassment trial involving Cpl. Catherine Galliford. The married female officer claimed she was pressured into having a sexual relationship with her fellow officer after she was caught by her husband who read text messages on her cell phone. It was either consensual or it wasn't. Either way having sex in patrol cars on duty pretty much demonstrates how unprofessional that force has become. It's a huge problem.
Since many of the allegations are of a sexual nature, it is tempting to fix the problem like you would fix your cat and nip it in the bud so to speak. Yet I'm looking beyond the sexual perversions in the force. I'm looking at the root of the problem. Galliford says the command and control structure at the RCMP means Mounties are instructed to do as they're told, or risk getting reprimanded. We need soldiers not sheep. Soldiers like General Romeo Dallaire not abusive idiots and wing nuts.
The problem I see begins at the beginning. It begins with Depot. Ever see the movie Full Metal Jacket? Abusive training breed psychopaths. The theory was break someone down then build them back up. It is a self defeating process because it teaches breaking someone down is good and right when it most certainly is not. It also leads to an undesirable conclusion.
Depot training can be hard and demanding without being so degrading and abusive. Get someone exhausted then build them up. That's how you train a reflex. What you train when you are exhausted trains a reflex. Abusing recruits when they are exhausted trains them to be abusive. That is what we are now seeing in the farce. To change that we have to begin at the beginning and make depot challenging but positive. Build their self esteem, build their self respect, then they will show respect for others.
"The problem I see begins at the beginning. It begins with Depot. Ever see the movie Full Metal Jacket? Abusive training breed psychopaths. The theory was break someone down then build them back up. It is a self defeating process because it teaches breaking someone down is good and right when it most certainly is not. It also leads to an undesirable conclusion.
ReplyDeleteDepot training can be hard and demanding without being so degrading and abusive. Get someone exhausted then build them up. That's how you train a reflex. What you train when you are exhausted trains a reflex. Abusing recruits when they are exhausted trains them to be abusive. That is what we are now seeing in the farce. To change that we have to begin at the beginning and make depot challenging but positive. Build their self esteem, build their self respect, then they will show respect for others."
-This is painful to read...
the training obviously could not be abusive as it exists as Canadas Federal Police training academy. From my understanding, the training new mounties get at their academy is a structured training program with design to prepare a civilian for the transformation into a peace officer.
You are so wrong dude. If you allow people to go into a training academy (for the purpose of becoming Police Officers) and carry in their own personal experiences, biases, theory, ideology, values, morals ect.. THEN you are asking for a Police state, and where Police would act on their own thoughts, idea of punishment ect.
I think you would agree in REAL life, Police have to face on a regular basis, people who radiate a palpable hatred towards them simply because they are a cop... Now, say you take an aspiring young female or male who wants to be a cop and throw them on the street without having ever experienced that "abuse" or unwarranted hate? what do you think would happen? or could happen? The officer could break down, back down, retreat, could over react, could put themselves in danger or the public.... the list goes on.
So save your kinder gentler bullshit for yourself.
Sounds like I hit the nail on the head. Kinder gentler bullshit? You are the one who doesn’t have a clue. Depot teaches abuse is OK when it’s not. The RCMP was once respected but now has become the most absurdly unprofessional organization in the country. Unprofessional. That is what it is in it’s current sate. To serve and protect has been forgotten. Now it’s gone from giving the civilians who pay their salary the boots and taser them when they are down and hog tied to running around like idiots sexually harassing and raping their own coworkers. Not to mention the hit and run DUIs.
ReplyDeleteIt’s not about kindler or gentler. Far from it. I was trained with old school abuse and that is how I used to train although it was not in any police force. I changed because I realized there was a better way. The better way was much more powerful than the abusive way. It empowered individuals to withstand abuse because of their self confidence and self respect not because they were used to getting abused. I wouldn’t call the New Zealand All Blacks kinder and gentler: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6g3QbH_i2VU
People hate cops because of their abusive nature. If they stopped being abusive to civilians, 90% of the people who hate cops wouldn’t. 10% would hate cops no matter what simply because they want to get away with committing crime. Yet one of the things you said clearly illustrates the seriousness of the problem.
You said: “You are so wrong dude. If you allow people to go into a training academy (for the purpose of becoming Police Officers) and carry in their own personal experiences, biases, theory, ideology, values, morals ect.. THEN you are asking for a Police state, and where Police would act on their own thoughts, idea of punishment ect.”
You are saying don’t allow people to join the RCMP if they have morals or values. That is inherently absurd. You don’t have to be religious to have morals and values but God help us if our police don’t have any. A civilized society is based on morals and values. Stealing is wrong. Committing rape is wrong. Committing assault is wrong. Selling crack is wrong. Those are all criminal acts that violate the law the police are paid to enforce. Those laws are framed on morals. Without morals, all of a sudden it’s OK to commit murder. We need morals in society and we need police officers who have morals and values so when they are commanded to cover up an unlawful act, they have the will and self respect to say no and obey the law. Training a police officer to break the law is absurd.
Give them experience on a walk along in East Van as part of their training. See how they interact and guide them accordingly. Don’t teach them to give someone the boots for giving them the finger claiming that’s what it’s like in the real world because it’s not. We live in a police state when we teach the police abuse is OK when it’s not. If Depot doesn’t change then we need to get rid of the RCMP in BC. Period.
I would be interested to see where you get all these stats from?. Are you on some sort board which regularly audits the RCMP?.
ReplyDeleteObviously.... the guys/gals in ANY outfit who break the law and commit crimes should be canned & prosecuted to the fullest extent. I am all on board for that.
& all these accounts of "cops giving people the boots for giving them the finger" or "taze-ing people who are hog tied" again, I would question where you get these from. If your response to that is "well.. the news says so" then I can't help ya.
The reason people hate Police is not because of abusive authority. It really is the Sheep/Sheepdog/Wolf analogy. The reason people (sheep) hate cops (sheepdogs) is because the cops tell them what they can not do and enforce it (speed, not signal, not make a full stop, not to park there, to turn down their music, not to drive drunk, beat their wife, fight, ect) Of course people will hate the person who tells them they can't. It has nothing to do with abusive.
example- take your everyday Joe. Going to work late is speeding and gets caught by a cop. It doesnt matter what that cop says or how the cops acts.. The guy is still going to hate that prick cop who just gave him a $100 ticket and didnt let him off with a warning.
It always amazes me how people think they will have some loving relationship with the Police if only __________. wake up.. its not going to happen... whether you call them RCMP/BC-PD, Surrey-PD... its still going to be the Sheep/Sheepdog relationship.
Marvin:
ReplyDelete"...save your kinder gentler bullshit..."
I have re-read the post and can't see those words or attitude anywhere from law and order minded Agent K. Marvin's post doesn't address the many nation-wide cases of serious problems with the Force. So much so that Harper's Gov't. has spoken to that issue.
The RC's still maintain strong vestiges of their historic mission of a real para-Military Force from Empire days. They were called upon to fight real military campaigns in Manitoba against the Metis, for example, and *tamed* the west for the Empire. They were our *Army* in those days. Those virtues are now out-of-place in a modern 21st century society that does not require a Para-Military outlook. RCMP have not fared well against sophisticated organized crime which has clearly established a serious foothold, to the extent of billions dollars/year here in BC. That is no Policing victory, indeed it is a most serious failure.
From 1850's to 1950'
s BC fared very well with a Provincial force that is dedicated only to BC-oriented Policing, with BC bred officers who know our Province intimately; & aren't re-shuffled off to Ontario every five years.
It sure takes one to know one, Hubertus! Thanks so much for your kind words.
DeleteMarvin, so we have consensus that people, including police, who break the law should be fired and prosecuted. As for my stats where to begin. Let’s begin with giving a guy the boots to in East Van for fingering the police. That was VPD.
ReplyDeleteBack when the APC was being spoilt brats about the Olympics I was arguing with one of them about police brutality. He said Pivot put together a report filled with affidavits listing police brutality in East Van. My response was, what, a bunch of crackheads claiming police brutality? He sent it to me and said just read it. The first one was an undercover RCMP officer. He was working undercover and was crossing the street. The police yelled at him and not wanting to blow his cover he gives them the finger. So the police beat the tar out of him. So he claimed in the court affidavit. I was somewhat shocked and said OK well that’s one witness with a bit of credibility.
Although the airport taser incident was a tragedy I do think it’s a bit over rated. Somebody was freaking out in the airport and they secured the situation. Tragic that in all that time no one got an interpreter. And yes they misused the weapon by tasering him repeatedly when he was on the ground and lied for each other covering it up.
The hogtied and tasered statistic comes from an RCMP Watchdog that reports 40 per cent of cases in Canada in which someone died after being hit with a Taser stun gun the person was hogtied: http://gangstersout.blogspot.com/2010/12/hogtied-and-tasered.html
That statistic shocked me. I had spoken out against the type of taser that shoots an electrode into a person’s body and lets the police officer crank the voltage at will. I am totally against that type of taser. It is way too much like the old shock therapy. One officer countered with if a suspect has a knife, using the projectile taser is safer. I could concede that point. Yet why on earth would anyone taser someone who is already hogtied? That is outrageous. It is a misuse of the weapon and can only be explained by a desire to punish or torture the prisoner.
The number of excessive force cases is staggering Geoff Mantler was seen on video kicking a complaint suspect in the head while he was on his knees. He was also photographed grinding a completely innocent suspect’s head and face into the ground after punching him in the head and knocking out one of his teeth. All because Mantler refused to take three seconds to hear that the company truck he was driving repossessed the boat someone had reported stolen.
The number of sexual harassment cases involving the RCMP is also staggering. Screwing up the Surrey Six case hits close to home. Cpl. Catherine Galliford’s case is just one of many. I agree that a cop giving someone a speeding ticket on a straight away will upset most people. Especially given the cost of tickets now. Yet I do think the arrogant attitude puts people off..
I really think the arrogance needs to be addressed. I could give many examples including personal experience. For now I’ll simply site a prominent regional officer of significant competence who said the RCMP has this attitude that their shit doesn’t stink. A rather peculiar metaphor which simply implies that they are brainwashed into believing they are the élite and so much better than everyone else, they genuinely believe they can do no wrong even when they do. I do think the abusive nature of depot needs to change because we see how that ripple effect has destroyed a once proud organization.
Freddy: Good point about Harpers new RCMP muzzle. That is simply outrageous. I personally think being able to transfer officers out of province and have other officers serve here is good for everyone. Can you imagine patrolling East Vancouver all your life? That would be depressing. I met two guys from the OMGU and one spoke with a French accent as though he was from Quebec. Nothing wrong with that. Quebec is great. I know the Vancouver Province newspaper has really being pushing for a Regional Police force in BC lately. Up until recently I’ve seen no real need for it and have expressed a desire to preserve the noble tradition of the Mounties that has currently been lost in space.
ReplyDeleteThese kind of Operations must eat up valuable resources that might be used for investigating organized crime;
ReplyDelete'largest ever' police spy operation."
"Police organizations across the country co-operated to spy on community organizations and activists in what the RCMP called one of the largest domestic intelligence operations in Canadian history, documents reveal."
"In all, the RCMP-led joint intelligence group — a conglomeration of federal, provincial and municipal police tasked with G8/G20 reconnaissance — employed more than 500 people at its peak, the records show."
"The JIG's targets included activists protesting the Olympics, the migrant-justice group No One Is Illegal, Southern Ontario Anarchist Resistance and Greenpeace."
http://tinyurl.com/6t5ygof (CBC)
I've always wondered whether this activity doesn't go too far in monitoring peaceful groups, who happen to arouse the ire of individual RCMP Officers.
I'm sorry, but No One Is Illegal is hardly a peaceful group. Have you seen the video of their leader, Harsha Walia promoting the violence at the Olympics?
ReplyDeletehttp://genuinewitty.com/harsha-walia-gone-wild/